The small differences between two cultures
Posted in Blog by Twenty Major on June 22nd, 2007
Salman Rushdie is given a knighthood for managing to produce a raft of tedious, hubristic novels.
Osama Bin Laden is given the equivalent for arranging and funding a bunch of nutters to fly jet airliners into tall buildings.
I bet you’d never have noticed the difference if I hadn’t pointed it out to you.
You’re right!
June 22nd, 2007 at 12:27 am
Meant to say thanks too.
June 22nd, 2007 at 12:28 am
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Religious people are always the most aggrieved, insulted, outraged bunch from the world stage right down to the village shop stage. The rest of us, the mainly secularists, trying to be measured and fair and to live and let live, tolerate their intolerance of us far beyond any thing they’ll tolerate about us. Religious people are contemptuous and sneering when the talk about the secular, and unbearably smug about their own salvation. But we all tolerate it.
why in almighty fuck do they care what we think, or whom a secular, Godless country knights?? Where was this pitch of outrage and marching and ridiculous flag-burning after the London bombings?
Religion is like an irrational, tantruming child who is unsure of himself and bullies the rest of us into humouring and appeasing him.
I’m getting really pissed off with the shrieking Christians, Muslims, Jews etc. of the world - all demanding respect and tolerance but not one of them willing to show any themselves. All these enraged purple faces and white-knuckled fists - yeah, they’re really bloody secure in their beliefs.
But you know, God help us all when the secular snap. We know it and they know it - we can’t snap. We have to buffer these idiots, keep them from killing men, women and children in their evil and horrifically imaginative ways in the name of their God. They can do what they like ‘cos they know we won’t and can’t snap to quite the same degree of insanity they do.
Secularism is the only hope for peace in the world. Religion is its antithesis. Sure, Jesus preached peace and love and my granny was mild as a lamb throughout her long religious life but Christianity doesn’t follow Christ’s teachings any more than Buddhists who, incidently, get the love thing much more than Christians. My granny was in a state of mortal fear her whole life. The whole thing was predicated on fear; if you don’t believe, you will burn. Further, believing isn’t enough - you have to believe in these particular ways that will put you at odds with the lady down the street, and however much you like her, you’ll not be able to get over the fact that she’s from a different synod from you, where they’re wierd/plain wrong/Satan trying to trick you/damned. My granny didn’t have a bad life at all but I’m angry about how highly respectable Protestant ministers manipulated her mind, her spending power and her fear, by getting her to bolster something nobody on earth can be all that sure about - pointy hat or not.
Fuck, there ought to be a word limit on comments - something needed to cut me off at about paragraph #3 - possibly 2.
June 22nd, 2007 at 1:37 am
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agree 100% problemchild. religion is a major problem in every country in the world. tribalism, superstition and ignorance at their worst. most, if not all, religions are not about god(s), but about power and control through fear.
i’d love to enact a law banning the teaching of any religion until the age of 18, when you can vote, drink, drive a car etc. teach ethics instead. if you gave a reasonably educated adult who had never been exposed to religion any of the major books of faith (bible, koran, torah, vedas…) and told them it was real, they’d laugh at you. religion is an extremely childish way of looking at the world, and that is borne out by the way adherents see themselves and each other.
funnily enough, if one of use tried to start our own religion today, most religious people would either laugh at us, or, more likely, condemn us for doing exactly the same thing the founders of their religions did long ago. the sooner all this bullshit dies out, the better.
June 22nd, 2007 at 3:11 am
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as far as salman and osama go, it all fits into the porridge theory of world politics:
people in cold countries tend to be less radical due to having to spend most of their time inside staying warm and fending off polar bears and eskimo and things.
people in warm countries tend to be nutjobs because they can spend all day running around outside in their underpants getting sunstroke and dehydrated.
case in point - salman rushdie writing (boring) critique of muslim religion and not blowing people up (cold country); osama bin laden declaring war on more or less everyone because they don’t think his invisible man in the sky is the best (hot country), and george bush declaring war on anyone still left standing (texas).
June 22nd, 2007 at 3:19 am
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Saddam and Salman - two bearded cunts. Saddam got hung and Salman gets a knighthood ? There’s no justice.
June 22nd, 2007 at 5:11 am
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Yeah religion is the problem.not its leaders and the money men they serve who manipulate religion to control populations for the same end, i.e money and power.they’re not the problem
June 22nd, 2007 at 6:55 am
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For all the talk above about devout followers of religion being smug, self righteous bastards there are some smug self righteous bastard like comments there also.
I am not saying that Porridge or Problemchildbride are wrong but some of the stuff they are decrying is evident in there own replies.
June 22nd, 2007 at 8:43 am
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I take your point scorchio but we’re playing with semantics here. When the other commentators say ‘religion’, I’m pretty sure they’re referring to the religious organizations which as you say, corrupt and manipulate their doctrines to serve their own interests.
The problem is that most religions by their very nature, do provide a rigid and authoritarian code of conduct backed up with some sort of divine retribution. This makes for a very fertile ground for their ambitious leaders to build closed, authoritarian and elitist environments where they are free to abuse both money and power.
Though not religious myself, I’m not particularly anti-religious either. As long as they leave me the fuck alone, people can pray to the tooth fairy for all I care. Wouldn’t it be cool though if you could get together with Jesus, Moses, Mohammed, Buda and Confucius and go for a pint. I reckon the banter would be only massive…..
June 22nd, 2007 at 8:56 am
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I hear you Lung,it’s just some people direct their ire at ordinary Muslims ,Jews ,whatever.
when the real cunts are the top men in religions.
It’s hard to be anything but misguided when you have been brainwashed from an early age for nefarious purposes.
The burning question is,Would Mohammed get a round in if he’s on the Ballygowan?
Would he need to get a round in if Jesus kept pulling off the Cannaan trick?
June 22nd, 2007 at 9:24 am
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The problem, Lung, is that they just WON’T leave you the fuck alone!
You are a danger to their delusional way of thinking, you are an independent mind, a free thinker, and free thought is dangerous to their tiny, incestuous closed cabal. You might just contaminate some of their wavering believers and thus reduce, however slightly, their power base.
If you look throughout history you will see the credence these religious nutjobs put on converts, look at how the missionaries in Africa in the 18th & 19th century went out and ‘converted’ the poor savage to whatever brand of delusion they currently believed in. When/if they returned home to their homelands they were judged on how big their flock of ‘converts’ was.
Dangerous, deluded and mutually exclusive religion should come with a health/sanity warning - ” Believe this at your peril ” , or something like that
Just my 2 pennorth
Grimy
June 22nd, 2007 at 9:27 am
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why cant we just get along? why?
June 22nd, 2007 at 9:39 am
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As long as there are humans on this planet there will be religion, so you might as well look else where for the problem/solution to the world, cuz you won’t be changing religion any time soon…
June 22nd, 2007 at 9:40 am
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why cant we just get along? why?
Why do people order well done fillet steak?
June 22nd, 2007 at 9:43 am
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Pants Man - point taken. It’s none of my business what people believe until it harms someone. It’s between themselves and their God and that’s fine. I come from what is possibly the most religious place left in Britain and love and respect and am related to some very devout people. But this is what has been making me angry over the past few years - and I’m going through a bit of an unsettling sea-change on the whole God thing myself, so perhaps that’s where some of the shrillness comes from in my comments on this:
The Catholic Church’s official and active preaching in Africa is that using a condom is much worse than getting AIDS. This is something I think Christians should be more vocal against the Vatican about. Something that could alleviate a lot of very real suffering.
In Animist and Muslim Africa, women are little more than chattel who must endure atrocities like circumcision, rape, servility and even stoning if their men deem it appropriate. I think there ought to be marching and flag-burning in the streets of Indonesia about that because stuff like that ought to be a fucking outrage to everyone, even co-religionists.
All over the world gays are shamed, denied their rights, and even killed because a book says they are an abomination. Why can’t we fix that?
Ah sure, Sam, but you’re only pointing out the bad stuff about religion - it also does a lot of good, you might say. To which i say in all sincerity: that’s great, it really is - I firmly believe in the right to worship as you choose but only if you do no harm to others with your beliefs.
That can’t happen because the religious say “You ought to live as I do. You are wrong and I am right. You, and you, and you are abominations and we will not stand for you.” Evangelism is one of Christianity’s (at least) most important tenets. Turn to any one of the myriad Christian broadcaster in US TV or radio and what you get, even from the mainstream, is so far from Chritianity as Christ taught as to make you blush for him. Am I wrong to be angry when that spills over into damaging public policy on whatever the right wing leaders have on their agendas?
The millions of ordinary believers all over the world give tacit permission to their leaders to cause the very real harm in the world they do, and they do this by unquestioningly granting them the authority to do so. This is the sin of staying quiet and letting it all happen far away - and as long as it’s nice for the Christening on Sunday - we can all feel warm and good about our religion and our families and what we allow to happen in our name.
Sorry for spewing on and on and on like this all over your comment box, Twenty. I just wanted to make it clear what it is that I think is dangerous enough about religion that we can’t ignore. I’m not out to change anybody’s mind about God - I believe in God, just not a personal God any more - I just think the world is going to hell in large part because of it and because it’s become so politically incorrect to criticise religion. I find it hard to tolerate intolerance is all.
June 22nd, 2007 at 9:46 am
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Get a fucking room the three of you
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:01 am
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Which 3 of us? I don’t want in any room with that globally-pooing Major fella.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:04 am
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Religion, as Christopher Hitchens puts it so well, “comes from the period of human prehistory where nobody, not even the mighty Democritus, who concluded that all matter was made from atoms, had the smallest idea what was going on.”
It is a tradition built on fictional fairy tales, based on founders who may or may not have existed in real life but who certainly did not do any of the impossible things they are claimed to have done, and perpetuated by a mix of naive people and charlatans.
It is also, in Ireland and elsewhere, used to encourage and facilitate the most horrific injustices, from stifling knowledge with a cloak of superstition, through to raping children and murdering people.
It does bring comfort to some, just as I could bring comfort to you if I told you that you will live for ever on top of the clouds if you follow my teachings until you die, and if you decided to believe me.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:05 am
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Look at the state of his chin-hairs for fuck’s sake! You can tell he’s really pooing too. You can. He has that concentrated, Free Church elder look to him.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:06 am
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Twenty Ordering Well done fillet steak is like asking for someone too be killed twice. Its just wrong.
Also Twenty if you are having difficulty writing your book and are worried about sales just mention that the bible is a story made up by Humans with a fancy for small kids, The Koran is written by Mohamad after he gave up alcohol( This is true I dont want to offend any Muslims)and that the Torah is made up by Some old jew.
Offend everyone the publicity will be great.Sales will be through the floor of the apartment above you.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:06 am
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Come join me in the Pootholic Church, Sam.
MacD - nice thinking. I’ve been aiming too low with the people I offend in the book.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:08 am
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I dunno Father Twenty. It’s true I’m having a bit of a spiritual crisis but I’m not at all sure about what the “offerings” in the Pootholic Church might involve. And I sure as hell wouldn’t take communion from you unless I’d seen you wash your hands. And Purelled them too from some handy pre-blessed bottle that didn’t jar too much with the altar schema. Or maybe put a wee curtain round it. Or you. If you’re pooing. I’m not handing over my immortal soul to anybody unhygienic.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:20 am
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As a non-believer you will go to a poo filled hell where water is poo, air is poo, earth is poo but Damien Rice is still just a cunt.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:22 am
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In some larger cosmic way it’s all just poo though, isn’t it. Except if String Theory’s right and it’s all just string. And the odds are, in the infinite multiverse String Theory predicts, that somewhere there is a land flowing with poo and honey. Or/and milk and poo. Or tears, sweat and poo. Or blood poo and tears. The possible combinations are literally infinite.
Holy shop fixtures, I’ve got to go to sleep and quit this poo-talk right the fuck now.
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:37 am
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In Poo Hell is Damien Rice Poo Satan or just his Poo servant?
June 22nd, 2007 at 10:51 am
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I reckon porridge gave the best solution (comment Nº. 4). Teach children secular ethics from an early age and when they’re older, they can go to the spiritual buffet and choose whichever bogyman that appeals to them. Unfortunately that would involve common sense, so I imagine every religion would be up in arms if it were to be implemented.
Twenty, I’m trying to picture them passing the plate around at your church and all that comes to mind is the film ‘Saló, 120 days of Sodom’.
June 22nd, 2007 at 11:14 am
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I’m thinking of founding a new religion based on sex.
Riding would be the equivalent of praying.
You’d go to hell if you stayed with the one partener too long.
Imagine the religious festivals
June 22nd, 2007 at 11:37 am
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Finally some is talking sense.
June 22nd, 2007 at 11:47 am
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Or someone is talking sense even.
June 22nd, 2007 at 11:48 am
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As the bible says ‘go forth and fornicate in the name of the lord’
June 22nd, 2007 at 11:49 am
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would ugly/herpes infected people be allowed in this religion?
June 22nd, 2007 at 12:18 pm
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I quite like “O”,. Yez are all bullys.
June 22nd, 2007 at 12:19 pm
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sheepworrier said:
would ugly/herpes infected people be allowed in this religion?
Don’t be so hard on yourself.
June 22nd, 2007 at 1:00 pm
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Peadar your a few thousand years late with that religion, The romans did sex based religion better than anyone, and the Festival of Bacchaus celebrated on the 16th and 17th of March is the proof. These infamous celebrations were notorious for their sexual and criminal character, got so out of hand that they were forbidden by the Roman Senate in 186 BC
June 22nd, 2007 at 1:26 pm
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Is there not already loads of sex in the church in ireland? Last time I checked there were still loads of “men of cloth gettin” it on..
A few questions on the new religion thing though:
1. Can we do anyday other than Sunday? It will really clash with my un-social life watchin sport.
2. Will there be a collection of cash cause I have the following problem at the moment with this… say i earn a euro, I give half it to the greens (or whatever the govt is called now). The greens use it to pay for Church Child abuse fund, I give the other half to the church and they use there bit to… you guessed it… pay for child abuse cases. So, I am paying for priests to get off the hook with child abuse? Go Figure!
3. Can we change the wine to cans of Devils Bit Cider
4. Can we shorten commandments from 10 to 2, maybe “thou shouldnt really get involved with neighbours wife unless she is a stunner and not gettin looked after at home” or…. rats I dont know any others
June 22nd, 2007 at 1:31 pm
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Tony Blair is converting to catholicism. So there ye go. Blair with a persecution complex…. it’ll give him something to do in his spare time. Religion with a purpose.
June 22nd, 2007 at 1:43 pm
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Yeah, all this over a book and a badge.
And it’s not like Osama ever persecuted or killed any Muslims…
Can you hear any “outrage” from the Muslim community about these fuckwits honouring Osama….
June 22nd, 2007 at 1:59 pm
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i’ve no problem with anyone believing whatever they want, as long as they leave me the fuck alone. terry pratchet made a great comment about religion in one of his books about why it is important to kill missionaries on sight. something along the lines of when you die, you go where you believe you should go, so if you don’t know about hell, you can’t go there.
twenty if you really want to go for it, you should insinuate that jesus, mohammed, buddha and the rest were all gay. a whole load of blokes hanging out together, with not a mention of lads night in watching the games live from the coliseum, or going down to the local disco to chat up women, get wasted and have a kebab/hotdog/puke on the way home. not a hint of “and jesus spake unto peter, saying “you lookin’ at my boord”, and yea, he did bringst him outside and smotest him in the camel park and there was much rejoicing”.
June 22nd, 2007 at 3:59 pm
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Twenty, I’m trying to picture them passing the plate around at your church and all that comes to mind is the film ‘Saló, 120 days of Sodom’.
I haven’t seen that so I’m not sure whether to be impressed or worried. Or possibly a little bit excited.
June 22nd, 2007 at 4:08 pm
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plot outline from imdb
“Four fascist libertines round up 18 teenage boys and girls and subject them to 120 days of physical, mental and sexual torture”
hopefully not excited
June 22nd, 2007 at 4:19 pm
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Religion is bollocks. All of it. ALL OF IT.
No good comes of it. Not even bake sales.
June 22nd, 2007 at 4:22 pm
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Ah now, I’ve got to disagree with you there, Andraste, The religious can bake. It’s how they lure you in.
June 22nd, 2007 at 4:31 pm
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you’d get a whole lot more people coming to mass if they had a nice cake buffet going along the altar rail, instead of handing out those stale cardboard wafer things. or what about replacing the pews with tables, have the altar boys doing waiter and the priest could be maitre d’ or compere? “i believe sir will find the 65 blood of christ to be a particularly fine year”
June 22nd, 2007 at 4:39 pm
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There would be no sexual abuse in my religion.
Everbody would be allowed have as much consentual sex as they want.
remember riding is praying, therefore priests would be at it more than anyone.
If, while been allowed have as much sex as they want, they still felt the need to abuse children, then they would be castrated in public.
The romans made a mess of it
June 22nd, 2007 at 5:10 pm
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And instead of the Ten Commandments you could have the Ten Promiscuous Positions.
June 22nd, 2007 at 6:02 pm
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and instead of the body of christ you could have the body of anybody
June 22nd, 2007 at 6:08 pm
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Erm..there’s really no nice way of describing this so here it goes. In ‘Saló’ one of the most harrowing scenes (against some competition, I might add) envolves the naked teenage captives having to eat human shit off a large silver diner platter. Impressed? Worried? Excited?
If you’re still interested, I’m sure Lucky Luciano has a bootleg DVD of it under the floorboards.
June 22nd, 2007 at 9:25 pm
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i can’t believe that the killing of a “blasphemer” is an accepted facet of their religion. it is absolutely mindboggling that they think they can kill somebody simply for not having their beliefs. and then on the the other side there is the belief that contraception ids wrong and al those paedophiles to boot. ALL religion is a bollocks. sign me up peadar
June 23rd, 2007 at 1:54 pm
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Here you lot, does anyone know whether this whole Gideon’s-Bible-in-every-hotel-room thing happens outside the states? You know, in case anyone decides to top themselves they can at least pick up the good book and maybe change their minds…. I reckon someone should form a counter organisation to replace the Gideon bible in every hotel room with one which is exactly the same just with the word “God” replaced by “Easter Bunny”. A laugh/questioning thought might be more effective than fire and brimstones/you’re-damned-now-you-cunt type shit….
June 24th, 2007 at 12:40 pm
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T
June 24th, 2007 at 1:26 pm
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To be honest, I’d say Osama got the award based on his little known charity work with the orphans and the rat people of Pakistan.
June 24th, 2007 at 1:28 pm
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